Last week, I peeked into the epicenter of hedonism as it advances. I was working in the kitchen while watching the news. I kept the TV on when Entertainment Tonight followed. I’ll skip the Bruce Jenner sex change hoopla and get straight to story that made me shudder. (Nowadays, it takes a lot.)
Famous person Kim Kardashian was interviewed on her upcoming book Selfish. It is over 300 pictures documenting decades of her selfies beginning at age 4 with an Instamatic camera. Think lifetime contributions, i.e.: Mother Teresa picking up dying people vs. Kim taking thousands upon thousands of pictures of herself. Get the picture? The big one, not the selfies.
The Buzz
I checked the Internet for Selfish buzz and you would think Kim was poised to win a Nobel Prize. On-line advanced copies sold out in one minute. I would have predicted no one would buy such a foolish book. I am out of touch. Selfishness has gone from repugnant to acceptable to extolled. I was still wrapping my mind around acceptable.
As I watched the interview, Kim was complimented on the perfect angles of herself. But she had a confession to make. Not all her photos are perfect. She admitted that it typically takes 500 shots to come up with one good enough to use. Shudder! Put some math to that statement and that’s a lot of time spent not for the benefit of mankind. While Isis is beheading Christians and humanity around the world needs every measure of help, someone can publish a book full of pictures of herself. And people buy it.
Being Remembered
Since Kim has already cornered the market on selfies, what do you want to be remembered for? During his radio show “Christ is the Answer,” Fr. John Riccardo said it was a question someone once asked him. How would you answer that question? What do you want your legacy to be?
Fr. Riccardo rejected the question. “I don’t want to be remembered for anything,” he said. Then, he asked how many people even know the maiden name of their great grandmothers? Most of us are simply not remembered at all, he pointed out. Instead, Fr. Riccardo said he wants Jesus to be remembered. “Jesus is the one that matters; not me,” he said. Living to bring Jesus to others so that it is Jesus and not he that is remembered, makes a life worthwhile according to him.
Holiness of Forgetfulness
Several years ago during a retreat, Msgr. Chad Gion presented pride as not just thinking you are better than others, but the preoccupation with self. “Humility only comes in self-forgetting, when I am not at the center,” he explained. “Christ lowered himself for us because love requires self-emptying. His death is the model of humility because he did not do it for himself. Christ did not die in our place to show us how great he was but he did it to show us how great his love was for us and through it, he did show us his greatness.”
Msgr. Gion described humility as elusive, as something that can only be achieved by abandoning it. “If we focus on it, praying: ‘Lord make me a humble man’ and then we serve others all the while looking inward, the more we focus on it the less likely we are achieving it. Inward concern about my humility contradicts the entire process.” He explained that in the end, “Doing everything you can to make yourself humble, makes it all about you.”
So even lowering yourself by saying, “Oh, I’m not so great,” or “they are better than me,” is still self-focused. Holy forgetfulness is when we think about others; serving them out of love rather than doing it for ourselves.
So put the camera down and pick someone up. For Jesus and for them. And don’t forget to pray for those who don’t understand. Otherwise, we become self-righteous. We are not better, we just have been blessed with the understanding that it’s not about us. And nowadays, that’s not an easy conclusion to arrive at.
112 thoughts on “Book “Selfish” Not Christ-like”
Excellent!!!
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I loved this piece so much. Entertainment Tonight is indeed inside the epicenter of the plague. I have the exact same visceral response as I have when I see images of birds on coastal shores soaked in oil from a tanker spill. In our lust for progress these poor things are collateral damage. Entertainment Tonight is like the giant oil tanker that spills a million tons of porn on our culture every night. I am sickened because I know this broadcast is a genuine depiction of the psychology of mainstream culture. I feel as if I am watching a grotesque horror show. On one hand I thank God that I don’t and can’t live the life they depict. On the other hand, I want to weep at how many souls are imprisoned thinking this is all there is to life.
At least there will never be mass murder and war (same thing) between entertainment tonight and the tonight show. The Muslims and Christians however are so proud of their “martyrs” letting themselves be killed for their beliefs. Comendable indeed. Sad and grotesque certainly. The Muslims are just as proud and just as convinced of th “truth” of their faith. As for the perfectly happy decent people that do not believe either story it is sickening having to cope with all of the destruction which affects ALL LIFE on earth.It is especially hard when you believe both sides to be wrong and as christians say of us non christians “lost”. Entertainment though useless generally is the least of mans problems.
A fine article, Patti. Evocative and much needed today. I think having children is
one of the most blessed and selfless things a person can do. A few of us, like me,
are called to the single life but I see the vast emptiness of so many of our
young adults who forego marriage and children just for the sake of pleasure. I
really liked your phrase “Put your camera down and pick someone up.”
Yes, the world is messed up, but we need to be more far concerned with the state of our individual
souls. To follow the teachings of Jesus “to obey the Commandments and to love
our neighbors as ourselves.” Are we doing this? Are we commenting with love?
As far as the creation of the Bible, I quote the “Catechism of the Catholic Church”:
CHAPTER TWO
GOD COMES TO
MEET MAN
50 By natural reason man can know God with
certainty, on the basis of his works. But there is another order of knowledge,
which man cannot possibly arrive at by his own powers: the order of divine
Revelation. Through an utterly free decision, God has revealed himself and
given himself to man. This he does by revealing the mystery, his plan of loving
goodness, formed from all eternity in Christ, for the benefit of all men. God
has fully revealed this plan by sending us his beloved Son, our Lord Jesus Christ,
and the Holy Spirit.
ARTICLE 1
THE
REVELATION OF GOD
I. God
Reveals His “Plan of Loving Goodness”
51 “It pleased God, in his goodness and
wisdom, to reveal himself and to make known the mystery of his will. His will
was that men should have access to the Father, through Christ, the Word made
flesh, in the Holy Spirit, and thus become sharers in the divine nature.”
Catechism of the Catholic Church http://www.usccb.org/beliefs-and-teachings/what-we-believe/catechism/catechism-of-the-catholic-church/epub/index.cfm
I am just a little curious as to your belief that having a child is one of the most selfless things that one can do. How so?
As most here know I am not christian. Nor any other religion.
Christians have been preaching for over 1500 years all of this love and beauty. Forgiveness and kindness. All the right things which I agree with less the supernatural mythology. However reality is that the vast majority live not by any teachings of the bible.The have no faith and live in fear. This is why they have spent time inventing new ever more powerful means of killing other humans that they fear.Does not the bible state unequivocally “thou shalt not kill”? Yet christians like to claim that USA is a christian country. All while encouraging the development of weapons and sending their children thousands of miles around the world to kill those that they fear along with hundreds of thousands of women and children? Is that faith in an devine love that teaches do not kill? Do not fear, do not judge. Turn the other cheek. I see no true christians. Even with those teachings they “interperate” something such that it fits their agenda. Believe it or not I did write this as well as other post with love.
First, let me say that I am thankful that you take the time to read and comment here. You obviously have a lot of questions, and you want answers.
I can relate because years ago I hated religion too. I didn’t even believe in God. When I sobered up I started believing in God and drifted into some New Age beliefs. But these still left me unfulfilled and hungry for a deeper truth.
I stumbled upon the Catholic TV station EWTN.com and some of it made sense. Several very brilliant people gave very eloquent and learned explanations for Catholic beliefs. One was G.K. Chesterton who said, “[W]here he [Christ] seems right to us is often in tune with matters not ancient but modern. From some of his utterances men might fairly call him a maniac; for others, men long centuries afterwards might justly call him a prophet. But what nobody can possibly call him is a Galilean from the time of Tiberius [Caesar].” I blinked, I swallowed, I blinked again. “So all of those Christians,” I thought, “Were right all along? And I was wrong?”… I believed.
After that my world turned upside down; everything now made sense: The creation of the world, my creation, my meaning, my purpose, my hope for the future. Now I do have joy and hope, real joy and real hope.
You say that most Christians don’t act like Christians? I totally agree. Very few go to church or act like Christians. It’s been a problem with the Church since the very beginning.
And you ask, “Why is having a child one of the most unselfish things that one can do?” The moment you create another human, is the moment you choose to spend the rest of your life putting somebody else, before yourself. This is one of the basic teachings of Jesus who said that we should love one another. Love is sacrifice. It’s not what we can get from someone else, but what we can give to someone else. Christianity says that a husband’s top goal is to help get his wife and kids to heaven. We are here to love God and to help our fellow man. So many are hurting, so many less fortunate, and we are here to help them. Christianity says that we should put others first, think of ourselves last. This is the essence of humility.
Jesus went so far as to lay down his life for others. He knew that to tell the truth, always, would lead to his crucifixion. This is heroic virtue. “No greater love has one this, than to lay down his life for his friends.”
I agree with you that we have done a terrible job in overseeing creation with the starvation, pollution, inequality, etc. These are caused by greed, materialism, callousness to others, all things that the Catholic Church teaches us not to do.
I think Christians, and others, whether believers or not, should keep speaking out about these things and putting them into practice.
And I have learned through hard experience to speak with kindness to our good brothers and sisters. I used to blast people, but I only made enemies. But we’re not trying to destroy the other guy, we’re trying to convince him of our side of the argument. I didn’t score any points by trying to annihilate the other guy. I found out that it’s good to befriend people, to think of them as my friend. As someone I would sit down and have a beer with—in my case, a Diet Coke.
Wonderful rely, Jamey! I know many Christians who seek God and embrace the teachings of Jesus. Picking people apart for failings is just an anti-religion tactic since ultimately, we are human and have failings. If you want to encounter heroic Christianity, consider the martyrs in the Middle East who are going to their deaths for their faith in Jesus Christ. True Christians? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uSv4vBcFyvo.
Yes, I know many people who try to live out their Christian faith, but you don’t hear too much about them. You don’t see the headline on the evening news:
“Family Goes to Church and Tries to Imitate Christ in Their Daily Lives.” To me, that’s a far more important story than the other drivel you hear.
Let us all pray for those who still walk in the darkness. Many of did the same for a very long time. Pray that the Lord opens up the hearts of every human on this planet, so that they may find their way to Him before they leave here. One has a choice, to seek out that which is good or true or to wallow in anger and despair.
How can you live in fear of your Creator, your God who left Heaven and all of its Beauty and Grace and wonderment , perfection, everything perfect…how can you not know what Jesus left to come here to this dank, hard, cold, hateful dark, war mongering place to be one of us and suffer being one of us? He left being God, the GOD of ALL to become a mere creature He created, a man, with all the pain and weaknesses and fears and hardships and insecurities to become you and BE YOU completely…and me….and then suffer and die a horrid betrayal to save YOU from what He as God allowed Himself to suffer? HOW can you FEAR this, fear HIM who loves you THIS MUCH? Do you have any idea what He gave UP FOR JUST YOU?
Very good article, so true. ‘ Fr. Riccardo said he wants Jesus to be remembered.’ That’s the whole problem right there, so many today worship themselves and throw Jesus right out the backdoor. When we die and face God is He going to see Christ in us or a selfie, self-centered, self loving disaster that did nothing but help in the decline of our world? What a thing to think about!
If heaven and hell were real few would find out that there are only a few thousand “souls” in heaven and trillions of souls in hell.
NO! texastea …NO….many would find that Jesus is all about mercy and forgiveness. That they go to Hell is because they do not repent of their sins, they defy their own Creator…do you understand what this means? YOU have to know that you offended God and you have to be sorry you did this and then you have to say to Jesus you are sick about this and that you did this to offend Him not because it damns you but because you offended your God who suffered and died to save you…..and because you WANT His LOVE…you have to understand that He loves you and did this to save you from yourself and Satan and HELL…………who are you? What ARE YOU? What do you want> Where do you want to spend Eternity? This is about you and who you are and where YOU will end up forever. FOREVER AND EVER..so what do you CHOOSE? You have freewill, CHOOSE well. Choose LOVE and Heaven and Jesus who loves you.
Did you change your mind? I promiseLOL I won’t bite. Disagree , perhaps. Bite, no. Peace be with you.
Ten children. SERIOUSLY! Talk about selfish. Which is doing more harm Kims selfies or 10 children. Which is more selfish? Having ten children that will consume tons and tons of useless junk in their lives ie phones clothes tv computer games and on and on. Housing and energy consumption. The earth cannot sustain people bringing 10 more energy and water destroying humans per couple into being. It is extremely selfish and destructful. Especially compared to some silly woman and her misguided ego. The author should shudder at her own selfishness.
PS. Where is the “hedonism”? Of all the things destroying us humans we worry about some silly woman or Bruce Jenner REALLY? BTW For every mother theresa there are at least 100,000 so called christians that pollute kill exploit and destroy everything on earth. That is not what their Jesus taught. It is as if the christians never read what he taught. They go to church then right back to their CEO job screwing people. Just as Jesus taught. NOT!!!!!!
Texastea2….Children are a gift from God. As human beings, we are fulfilling our God-given mandate to be fruitful and multiply when we have children. How can this be selfish?? Having 8 children and adopting 2 orphans shows a family full of love.
The earthly relationship between children and parents is representative of the relationship between Christians and the Heavenly Father.
Experts linked selfies with mental illness by suggesting that people regularly searching for the perfect angle from which to portray themselves could in some cases be ill.
One leading psychiatrist said the majority of patients he sees with Body Dysmorphic Disorder take a lot of selfies.
Dr David Veale, a consultant psychiatrist at the South London and Maudsley NHS Trust and The Priory Hospital, told The Sunday Mirror: ‘Two out of three of all the patients who come to see me with Body Dysmorphic Disorder (BDD) since the rise of camera phones have a compulsion to repeatedly take and post selfies on social media sites
Kim K. has a mental disorder. Anyone that buys her book is more of an idiot than she is.
“Children are a gift from God. As human beings, we are fulfilling our God-given mandate to be fruitful and multiply when we have children.”
The saying “be fruitful and multiply” is not universal. It applied to Adam and Eve and Noah’s family after the flood. And those are myths anyway.
It is extremely foolish to think those words apply to all people in all places for all time.
I could care less if Kim Kardashian has what “experts” call a mental disorder. Overpopulation,exploitation and depletion of resources I care greatly about. That is a disorder that affects EVERYONE.The relationship between parent and child is not representative of some myth. It is a special shared between the parent and child. Nothing more nothing less. Beautiful YES supernatural,no.
Overpopulation is a huge problem. Having 10 children selfishly affects others that do not want to add to the destructiveness of our over population. They decide to selflessly do the right thing and sacrifice their own deep desire for parenthood for the sake of the many. That is reality. Having 10 children might be your right but it is destructive and selfish.
What statistics do you have to back up your claim of “overpopulation?” I’m confused as to what overpopulation means. We can fit everyone in a land mass the size of Texas with each individual given a condo (although most people don’t live alone). Plus for most of the world, the birth rate is so low that it’s below population replacement levels.
Yes, exploitation is terrible. But how exactly is having children exploitation? Most instances of exploitation is the result of corruption. We should be encouraging morality in governments and stability.
You mention pollution, but it’s people who come up with innovative ways to combat and clean. If you keep cutting the number of people to help in those regards, then whose going to help? The oil spill in the Gulf was cleaned up with the aid of….people some of whom came up with good ideas like using hair. Without such people, the oil spill would have taken longer to clean up.
if you believe so strongly in overpopulation, who do you think shouldn’t be here? Me? You?
Statistics? I call it common sense. We do not have time to wait for “expert” studies and statistics. Where are your “stats” for the sustainability of billions of humans in an area the size of texas? That is ridiculous. Human population can self sustain and thrive with less than one million.
Having 10 babies contributes to the exploitation of the earth itself. Humans control the population of damn near every mammal on the planet. Why? Because we think if we do not they will destroy the tiny habitat which we humans have not yet destroyed.
You are confused as to what overpopulation means. It means the population is too large to be sustainable. This is a finite planet with finite resources. That means it is not limitless.
You state that for most of the world the birthrate is so low the population is not able to maintain. Yet we are increasing in population at a rate of >40,000,000 per year which is more than the entire world population for most of human existence. Where are your “stats” on most of the world declining in population? This I must see.
You mention that people come up with innovative ways to clean up pollution. Wonder how that pollution got into the gulf. If you know anything at all about that particular oil spill ( one of many many more) then you know the hair did not clean up the many millions of gallons of oil.
The US is <5% of the population yet consumes nearly 30% of the energy resources. Now China and India as well as Brazil Indonesia and others are starting to increase their consumption over 1 billion people. The reason that rig was in the gulf in DEEP WATER is because we have depleted the easier sources. Same for fracturing and tar sands. Why are we resorting to these means? Because of the demand by so many. We are just getting started and we are already running out.
I am not advocating for ANYONE to not be here. All I am asking is to breed responsibly. If every woman of fertility age had 10 children then in 200 (much less 2000 or 20,000) years we would be close to extinction. I fear that within 30 years there will be wars over water. Forget the oil it will be gone.
It is logic and common sense the statistics you ask about are extensive. One just needs to look.
Ah…so you admit that you don’t have a shred of proof for over population.
As for fitting everyone in the state of Texas, that’s basic math. You take the land mass of Texas and divide it by the total number of people.
You say people control mammals because we think mammals will destroy the habitat? That doesn’t make any sense. Do you have any studies to proport your theory or is this just wishful thinking?
Can you prove that the planet has a finite amount of resources? How much of say oil or coal do we have left? I’m sorry but this scare tactic has been used before. And was found wanting.
Google “birth rate” and you will see the birth rate for each country. To sustain a population you need a birth rate of 2.1 The reason our population is as large as it is today is because our life span has increased. You can also Google that.
I’m sorry but are you inferring that people should stop using electricity, natural gas, oil, etc. Do you plan on being “one with nature?” I see that you are using electricity to power your internet connection and device. Where do you think that that electricity comes from? Do you have anything with plastic in it? Where does plastic come from? It would be rather hypocritical to say that no oil should be used, but then use it yourself.
Over consumption largely rests with companies. Individuals don’t consume as much as you think. But if your concerned about consumption hows about stop using the device you are typing on. I’m sure Apple or Microsoft will stop making products when people stop purchasing them.
As for “breeding” responsible…large families are more eco-friendly than small ones. They pass down clothing, eat all the food before it spoils, still use fridge, can share one bath (like the Japanese do), etc. Perhaps you should be advocating for people to live in multi-generational housing. But again, you need to show how you’ve come to the conclusion that we’re running out of resources. I’ve heard that one before.
Here’s some of these so called predictions in the 1970s. I haven’t seen it happen.
http://wattsupwiththat.com/2013/03/01/global-cooling-compilation/
http://lolitsthad.com/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=44708
I have no desire to engage in childish behaviour with you. However, breifly I will state the obvious. The earth is of a finite mass a finite radius which allows for a finite volume of oil that it could possibly house. Even if you fillid it to the last drop it would only hold so much.
My not giving you sources which you apparently are too lazy or unconcerned enough to find on your own. Any 13 yr old can. Does not mean it is not true. Have a good life. Your denial does nothing but cause harm. I guess we are digging bithmous and turning into synthetic oil because as you believe we have plenty or oil and it is free and using three barrels of water to create on barrel of oil is smart and sustainable.
If we are wrong worst case scenario is less pollution and more sustainability. If you are wrong we are doomed if we follow your way. And dear friend with all due respect.
I usually do not do this with people of your beliefs for no amount of evidence will convince you. You choose to believe those that have profit to lose. I will get back to you though with plenty of science you astonishingly have not seen for yourself. Peace.
PS just because one could squeeze every human in texas does not make it plausable. It is astronimacally absurd. Peace be with you
Ah…so you admit that you have no idea how much of any resource we have left. You can’t produce any sources in other words.
The resources on the earth are largely renewable and self-sustaining. You can recycle metals. You can filter water (drink it and then pee it back out, repeat). And oil comes from organic material. In other words things died and became oil. But you can keep believing in your doomsday scenario if you want to. It simply isn’t sustainable and every prediction ever made has fallen flat.
And yes, I agree that it would be silly to give every family on earth a house with a yard in a suburban sprawl the size of Texas. But the model makes the point that having enough land mass for everyone currently on earth is not a problem.
You’ve yet to show how it is terribly selfish to have 10 children based on the irrational belief of overpopulation. If you were talking about as the Pope did being a responsible parent with regards to personal health, then I would agree. I’m sure there are some people as the Pope said that are endangering their lives and potentially harming their family because children are viewed as bling or what have you. But I seriously doubt the author is one of them, and as I don’t know the author personally and am not a spiritual adviser, it’s not my judgement call. And it shouldn’t be yours either. However many children a couple has is none of my business, and it isn’t anybody else’s business about how many children I have either.
You admit then, and more rubbish. I have dpne this before with those as yourself. You appear to have no grasp of how the earths life sustaining systems work. This childish tit for tat is stupid. As if you can prove that our resources are renewable at the rate we are consuming them. Absurd. It took million and millions of years in order for a dino ( yes they really did exist) to become oil.Or for peat to become coal. I am certainly glad that your “theory” is far to the right VERY FAR from the scientific community.
Might I suggest that you try visiting a few scientific sites. There is where you will find the evidence you claim does not exist. I am to busy or perhaps to lazy to just hand them to you. I do not think any of it will matter to you. Have a great life.
Perhaps you will listen to what your Pope has written. It has been leaked ( not surprising) but should officially be released thursday.
You seem to trust the Pope. I hope that he can trust you as well. No more stalling and dodging.
Straight from the pope. Will you scold him as you do the rest who are just trying to save your great great grandchildren?
Yes, no one wants to squeeze everyone into Texas but it makes a point, the Earth is nowhere near overcrowded. Get out of town, fly across the country or around the world–there’s more open space than occupied space. You sound very worried. If you do a bit of research, you will find that the Earth is doing very well. I hear Heaven still has plenty of space too. So the more souls the merrier. Btw, the two AIDS orphans we took in from Kenya, one just became a Marine and is going to become a doctor through them and the other is graduating from medical school next month. Here is something to relieve your fears: http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2015/04/23/happy-earth-day-2015-earth-is-doing-just-fine-thank/?cmpid=cmty_twitter_fn
There was no ill intent in my original post. I tried to show you guys(and succeeded) that you are hypocrites. You and all that claim all the wild nonsense I have gotten think it is Jesus like or at least fine to criticize KK and those that are fans of hers. Wasted life basically Hedonistic!! Don’t get that one. That is perfectly fine and seemingly admirable to Christians on this site. That is not what the bible says. I feel that 10 children is selfish. SO WHAT. My point is you criticize and think that you are better or you would not criticize publicly. You my dear friend were wrong in my opinion. Perhaps if you reread the book you will understand. Do the Math on what would happen if every woman had 10 children!. Disregard the world ending belief and for argument sake pretend that the world keeps going and the end is NOT nigh. I believe that you are wonderful mother and if possible please adopt more children. Criticizing others does no good. Just as my post did no good unless it shows you that it is different when it is US being criticized. Do you personally know miss K? Have you walked in her shoes?
As far as the population. The world cannot sustain our pop. the way in which we are living. PERIOD search ocean depletion climate change ground water depletion air pollution. Oil depletion land destruction visit the University of your choice. Please however try visiting non religious University. Science sites USGS all sorts of data and studies. I will repeat Do the math. Follow the money and you will see who is behind the all is well nonsense. Peace be with you.
Ps That “open space” you refer to is actually occupied. It is all that is left for the non human forms of life. Life that is being extinguished at an alarming rate. Over 100 species gone ( extinct) per week. We are not the only ones.
Read Merriwether Lewis’ journal and try to imagine how pristine and abundunt non human life was. Now all non human life ( with the exception of domesticated animals) are on average about a whopping 6% of their historical numbers.
Just some words for thought.
Maybe if you had some children, you wouldn’t be so crabby and angry and freaked out. Your life must be one horrifying day after another. I cannot even imagine living with such fear, especially when it comes from fiction. Wow.
I hope that your life is well and thanks for your concern. You do not know how many children I have. As you cannot imagine living in such fear I cannot imagine living in such ignorance. You actually do live in fear. It is fear of the unknown that scares you. NOT ME.
Why are so afraid. You will be long dead before any overpopulation occurs. Why don’t you just leave it all in God’s hands and stop hating people for living as God intended? You are completely wrong. Everything you stated is wrong. I am sorry to have to tell you this, but you know nothing about what you speak.
I am not afraid. Because God is only in your imagination.I am not completely wrong.I am not at all sorry about telling you that your ignorance is what compels me to continue. Your faith in myths has apparently you fooled into believing everything will be great. Myths will not stop us from paying the price for our actions.
I have no idea where you rationally arrive at your conclusions. Overpopulation is not simply fitting the 7 billion people into Texas. Overpopulation occurs when the number of people exceeds the carrying capacity of the region…the carrying capacity of the world is a function of agricultural resources, non renewable resources, water supply, quality of life issues etc.
Look at data:Today 7.7 billion; 2040 9 billion World Population Prospects”. United Nations. Retrieved 2011-11-30
It is true that world birth rates are declining, however human longevity is expanding. Les being born, but more living longer and more people as a result. Myrskylä, M.; Kohler, H. P.; Billari, F. C. (2009). “Advances in development reverse fertility declines”. Nature 460 (7256): 741–743. doi:10.1038/nature08230.PMID 19661915.
There are dozens of factors which constrain sustainability and dozens of data sources: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Human_overpopulation
It’s true you could fit the 7 billion people of world into Texas, at about a space of 1,000 sq ft per person. No rooms for hospitals, schools, work places, churches, or prisons. Give the amount of actual habitable land on our plant, your comparison limps.
Can we sustain this level of growth without depleting all the resources of the planet and provide a sustenance for 9 billion future people? Probably not…
If you read down thread, I explain that it’s a model. It shows that land mass is not a problem. In that same post, I explain that the earth is a self-sustaining eco system. People have been making predictions in the 1930s and 1970s etc about when people will starve to death, we’ll end up with smog covered skies, etc. There was one scientist who predicted that we would run out of oil in the year 2000. He said we would go to the pump and there would be no gas. Obviously he was wrong.
I don’t give into doomsday predictions particularly when deciding the number of children I should have. I believe in the genius in every human person. We are constantly coming up with more and more creative ways of doing things. Do I believe that we can sustain our comforts as things stand to a group of 9 billion? No. But we aren’t doing the same thing we did in the 1930s and 1970s. Cars have improved in terms of emission. Ways we grow food have changed. I expect that improvements to continue. And it is with that in mind that I feel 9 billion is totally sustainable.
So no I don’t think it’s selfish to have 10 children because I don’t believe in an overpopulation myth.
Does that help clarify?
National Catholic Reporter, January 20, 2015:
“On his return trip from Asia, Pope Francis made strong statements supporting the church’s ban on artificial means of birth control. He also said Catholics should practice “responsible parenthood” and don’t have to breed “like rabbits.”
Speaking with reporters on a flight Monday from the Philippines to Rome, Francis encouraged the use of church-approved contraception.
The National Catholic Reporter says Francis “made what appears to be an unprecedented statement that Catholics may have a moral responsibility to limit the number of their children.”
Now why do you think the Pope addressed this issue in Philippines where poverty and hunger are rampant?
” ‘God gives you methods to be responsible,’ he continued. ‘Some think that — excuse the word — that in order to be good Catholics we have to be like rabbits. No.’ ”
Do I feel 10 kids is responsible? No, a a general rule!
You are completely taking the Pope out of context. There’s another article, I believe, here on Catholic Stand that addresses that point.
It’s no secret that the teaches responsible parenthood. I actually mention it below. There are numerous reasons for couples to limit the number of children that they have. Again the Church teaches this. But it’s up to the individual couple to decide based on their particular circumstance.
The original commenter claimed that it was selfish based on the erroneous assumption of overpopulation that the author should not have had 8 children plus adopted 2 more. He seems to be implying that ANY couple who has 10 children is being selfish based on that premise alone. And that isn’t Church teaching.
I should point out that the Pope has gone on to praise large families and to condemn those who limit their families for purely selfish reasons.
So no matter what you feel is irrelevant. The number of children rests with the individual couples and God.
The present population of the world is 7+ billion….the carrying capacity of the plant is abut 9-10 billion. You provide many assumptions and beliefs without substantive data. Do you actually believe that the carrying capacity of earth is limitless? Data….
http://www.livescience.com/16493-people-planet-earth-support.html
*sigh* And your side keeps pulling out numbers that really are based on speculation. More like staring into a crystal ball. I’ve heard people make assumptions about what would happen when we got to 7 billion. So predictions about 9 or 10 billion don’t scare me. More importantly they are not ligit reasons for limiting family size, and that’s according to the Church.
http://thefederalist.com/2015/04/24/seven-big-failed-environmentalist-predictions/
Did you research Robert Tracinski and his background in writing such a biased article. He does have a BA in Philosophy, he was a disciple of Ayn Rand, and he was Director of the Center for for the Moral Defense of Capitalism….btw the ARI has distanced itself from Tracinski. Not a scientist, not even a remotely academic background in science ….just a plain olde biased unabashed capitalist defender.
I feel like beating a dead horse here….It doesn’t matter what you, or I, or Mr. Tracnski, or the scientists from the 1970s think.
Using overpopulation as the reason behind limiting the size of ones family is not legitimate. This is not according to me. This is according to the Church. The Church has never issued a proclamation stating couples should limit their children to X number. The Church has never said environmental/overpopulation reasons are okay to use.
If you want to get upset about that, fine. But you’re argument is not with me. I am not the Pope or the Magisterium.
Speaking of beating dead horses. I for one will not rest and give up and claim that the science is wrong just because a religion that actually believes the world is a few thousand years old and humans used to live
(at least some) to be hundreds of years old and the earth came before sunlight says keep multiplying. The federalist!! Really. Try NASA USGS Oxford, Harvard U of Chicago Woods hole institute. Smithsonian and hundreds more. Read literature from many different sources. You will find that most agree this axasperatingly stupid system of constant growth is simply NOT SUSTAINABLE.
The discussion is over. Kindly move on.
The discussion will be over when we stop destroying the planet that we (all living humans) RENT from generations yet to live. This is not about you or I nor is it about religion. It is about future generations and the conditions that we leave them to deal with when you and I are gone. Malthuism simply theorizes that when human population growth surpasses crop production human civilization will recede to a primitive form. It has not happened yet due to scientist deriving chemicals (in large part from oil) such as fertilizers pesticides fungicides herbicide combined with tapping into ground water at an UNSUSTAINABLE rate. We have done away with crop diversity and are genetically modifying plants in order to increase production. This form of science you seem to trust and have faith in. Scientist whom are paid by ruthless corporations such as Monsanto and Cargill Dow Chemical and Dupont. The day of reckoning IS coming. You have faith in some God which is well and fine by me. When many millions are taught to have that same faith and to ignor the overwhelming evidence and keep muliplying unchecked because “the church says to” the rest must speak up. Oil gave us this way of living not any God. All of our descendents will pay for that belief and faith.
Our discussion is over. Kindly move on.
Kindly stop replying. That is all you ever had to do. Simply stop writing. Sigh!!!
Have a great life and please think of your great grandchildren I dare even ask that you think of mine and everyones. Think 5 or 5000 generations from now.perhaps that will help you to understand the consequences of our actions. Peace
I did stop replying…to you. You are the one who jumped on another thread and spoke to me. And still keep speaking to me. And still keep babbling nonsense without offering any proof. Not a single link. Please cease ALL discussions with me.
OMG. Not a single link. Wow you really will use anything as an excuse. Again ANY and Every university. Try google. It is not difficult. If you choose not to try because I do not provide you a “link” ( can’t on my 20$ mobile) you simply do not want to see evidence. Funny how you live your life based upon nonsense without any shred of evidence backing it up. In fact the evidence points strongly to the entire story being a myth. I could give you link after link it would not matter. Be on your way please. If you do not want to debate (you are not open to any debate) stop commenting on this thread. Go find another story another topic. HELLO!! Again !! Sigh!! Just please let it go and have a great week.
The church believes that the end is NIGH so why bother. They also believed that the earth was the center of the universe. They were wrong on that as well. Magic mystery beings called God are not coming to save the righteous and teach (burn in hell) those that failed to disregard their own brain and assimilate to the church. John the baptist thought that the saviour would come back in his lifetime. Wrong. Everyone since as well. Has not and will NEVER happen.
Firstly I’m so boggled by your comment as it sounds rather incoherent to me. I’m not entirely sure how to respond. I’m very close to believing that you are trolling and harassing me rather than being interested in actual dialogue. Perhaps the moderators can proffer what to do.
It is not quite boggling whenyou think about. You trust believe and try to practice what the church says or preaches. My point is this. The church has been wrong on many matters. Thanks in part to the facts showing the church to be wrong on many things (earth is center of universe, age of earth and others) the church is no longer the ruling dictatorship of old. The 2nd part about the end being nigh is very relevent when discussing population and resources. The Catholic church and Christianity as a whole believe that they know how the future will unfold. ARMAGEDON and genocide then paradise for the ones not BURNING in HELL. Most Christians believe that this will happen in their lifetime. As apparently John the baptist. did. Almost all if not all since have mistakenly believed the same. The end is nigh!! Now if one believes that they know how the earth ends why bother with population resources pollution heck Anything. Those of us who do not believe this bizzare story understand the finite amount of Anything on this planet or how many humans it can support eith variables for lifestyle.
I hope that deboggles it for you. As forthe moderator proffering what to do. I have no idea what you are stating.
Let’s back up a bit…
The Church is not an authority on science. It’s an authority on morality and faith. It’s never claimed to be a science authority and doesn’t make any claims about science other than bioethics.
Secondly the Church teaches about conservation and taking care of the planet.
Thirdly, the Church doesn’t know when the end is coming. In fact the Bible says no one knows when the end is coming. Those who try to predict that are clearly wrong.
Lastly, The Catholic Stand doesn’t stand for trolling. What exactly are you hoping? Are you interested in engaging in dialogue? Are you interested in hearing an opposing view? Thus far some of comments have been questionable when it comes to charity.
All of this talk of trolling PLEASE.
You seem to be the one opposed to an opposing view.
The catholic church used to be the authority on EVERYTHING geeze, not as if that is some new discovery. They still weigh in on science and state whether or not some discovery or theoryts in withthe doctrine and teaching.If it does not it is not accepted. The church fought against evolution until they figured out a way to spin it into fitting within doctrine.
I guess the church isn’t the best teacher of conservation and caring for the earth. Most replies I have received claim that the earth is doing fine. Which is contrary to the evidence (heck it is contrary to common sense.
The bible also states that there will be signs. Use of the weather storms violence and wars all the middle east turmoil. Russia and china asserting themselves. All are signs of time for your Jesus to return and reign after the genocide is over. The catholiccurch is aware of this and does have an opinion.
I am not hoping for anything from you. YOU replied to me or have you forgotten?
I have no idea as to what youritent ws when reffering to “charity”. I will say however that your church does some very good kind work through charities such as “Dorothy Day”. We could use more of them but most of us cannot because we do not have billions of dollars in assets nor tax free status.
Lastly are YOU interested in dialogue? Are do you just want to have someone confirm your belief that it is “christ like” to criticize those you believe to be at the “epicenter of hedonism”?
Yes, I replied to you. Asked you for info and you refused to give any. Then I made my point. That usually closes a dialogue. Instead you intend to circle the drain. No point. That’s trying to strong arm someone to agree with you. I hate to break it to you, but if your goal is to “win” arguments on the internet, it probably won’t happen. True dialogue is making inquiry and stating your point. It’s not about winning or convincing. So yes, I’m interested in dialogue. We already engaged in that. Its over.
As to your second point, I’m not the author of the post. I didn’t criticize anyone. That wasn’t even what I was addressing in the original dialogue. I was addressing the fact that you were using overpopulation as reason to limit the number of children a couple has. I was addressing that overpopulation was a myth.
I wish you well. Blessings.
How is it that overpopulation is a myth? Is there ANY limit to human population? Do you accept the fact that the oceans are being depleted? How about water being depleted at an alarming rate? Climate change due to pollution humans pump into the atmosphere and the destruction of the forest and
wetlands rivers and lakes. Ground water falling quickly? Do you just not think these things are happening? I invite you to visit ANYand ALL accredited institution of higher education. See what they have to say on these matters.
A child in Africa on average today will consume less resources in a lifetime than a child in the so called west will consume in a few years. Everyone wants to consume as much as us idiots in the west. The earth cannot sustain such consumption. So unless you are advocating for us to return to a life such as when Jesus
was alive it appears to me that we need to stop this unsustainable madness and stop breeding as rabbits. Humans are not rabbits. Rabbits do far less destruction and have predators that keep the population in check as do ALL OTHER ANIMALS. Well wishes to you and your familia. Peace be with you.
The pope just stated the dire straits we are in. Stop using so much energy and resourses or we are doomed. I agree. Net no gain in population is the only way. It is called LOGIC not Religous Myth.
Clearly you were working off a bad copy. The actual encyclical addresses population control and specifies that that’s not the way to deal with over-consumption.
At this time the masses of catholics are not willing to accept the inevitable. Which of course, is population growth reduction. Neither are 99% of the rest of us humans.
With that in mind one can understand the limits which dictate just how far the Pope can go.
The bible says; go forth and multiply. Not multiply until you cause your own extinction..
Population will have to be checked someday. Endless growth is simply not possible.
I do understand your beliefs but none the less we must make many changes and sacrifices if we want to survive for a few hours on the universal clock.
Have a great day tomorrow.
because you are unable to understand or comprehend what the Church teaches hardly indicates you know what you are writing.
Just because you understand something apparently does not make it real. Just because “a” (not “the” ) church teaches something does not mean they are teaching facts instead of myths or beliefs.
As well for you. Just because you choose to bury your head in the sand so as to not see what is happening all around you does not mean that it is not happening. Your writing (which is basically that we can move to the sahara and kill all life that does not feed us and I guess pump in trillions and trillions of barrels of water) shows that you do not understand basic biology biodiversity or how the earth evolved an intertwined life support system that is complex and delicate. It appears that you have no understanding of life at all. But I still wish you well. I am sure that your grandchildren will have a much better understanding than you. They can thank you for the life you took from their grandchildren
right, as though everyone should believe what you write? you have no evidence to back it up. what is it that makes you believe everyone should believe what you teach? especially, when what you teach is totally unsupportable with reason or logic or facts.
I have lots of evidence which ( again) is a simple search engine away from you learning for yourself. No disrespect but I find it very funny and ironic when christians demand facts. Their entire “faith” is baseless as far as facts are concerned. Not even a shred of evidence. What specific evidence do you want? You show me evidence that god even exist!! Do not worry I will not hold my breath. According to the bible the earth is less than 12000 yrs old. All humans descended fron noah and every other living thing was on the ark when sea levels were 27000ft higher. Jesus raised the dead on and on. No evidence exist supporting any of that. I will accept a LOGICAL explanation
You funny. 🙂
I have a big family too. Know what? The resources we consume, the products we buy, those consumables mean that a lot of other folks have jobs, jobs, jobs. 🙂
Don’t know why you’re so obsessed, texas…here’s hoping you put a little whiskey in that tea of yours and calm down. We’ve got a huge, huge world, and the children in it aren’t the problem.
People who hate the kids are.
Pax,
JDM85
Humans do not need jobs. Jobs at the factory jobs on wall street or jobs in the military nor jobs at junk food joints.
Humans need food water shelter and love. Not jobs in an economic system that destroys those precious resources.
I attempted to enlighten you. You are not ready to be enlightened at this time. If one tries to save ALL children it is love not hate that drives them.
If you truly believe that more people means more jobs and jobs are the most important thing you are another christian that does not truly believe.
Even when your Pope tells you we are in dire straits you ignore him.
Perhaps if you would pollute a little more consume a little more you could create another job or two. Of course last time I checked humans do not drink nor eat jobs.
I wish you and yours well.(Hate children)? Wow
Texastea: Humans don’t need jobs? (*chuckle*) they live on love? (*2xChuckle*).
Without work (either for ourselves or others), we don’t eat, my dear. Or do you subscribe to the idea of the magical fairie who will wave her wand and make checks appear in the mail each month?
Methinks you’ve been hanging out at your local university’s English department a little too long. 🙂
What you’re doing with you ‘enlightenment’ speech is attempting to put me on the defensive via name calling. Sorry, not working. 🙂 Been around the block a few too many times.
Saving children? By preventing them from being born? By saying there are too many of them?
Tee Hee! Uh Huh.
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/B8ELApGCUAAuVxw.jpg
Perhaps you will listen to your Pope. Read what he has to say. Learn!!!!!! before, as your leader says, the DIRE consequences are upon ALL of earth and all of humanity. Perhaps now you will stop being part of the problem. I wish you and your family well.
Please read what your Pope has to say on environment water all resources. Perhaps you will heed his warning
you are merely writing thoughts from your imagination. you have nothing to support them. that is why they are called imaginary concepts.
I am glad you mentioned imaginary.Adam and eve (imaginary) the tree of life the serpent temptor, 40 years wondering the desert parting of red sea. Feeding so many with one fish, living in a whale. Infinite god with no beginning and no end. This could go on for days or for “eternity” in ones imagination.
you are correct. this scare tactic is called Malthusian.
The federalist!!!! Are you joking? The church? You claimed that the church has NEVER been an authority on science. If humans keep on the way that we are believing that some omnipotent being will save us we are doomed. Genocide by ignorance.
Your right more people consuming more resources equals more sustainability. I see your logic now. More consumption.
Ps. People have been predicting the Messiah for the Jews, second coming of Jesus and whoever the Muslims are predicting as well as the fifth Buddha for THOUSANDS of years.
Yet it never has ( and never will I predict) yet you still wait with unaltering faith. HMM
I reject your arbitrary limitation on the number of people this planet can support. did your scientists vote on the issue? voting seems to have supplanted the scientific method among scientists in the 21st century.
as a general rule, people should have however many children as they can adequately support. I reject your general rule as being dictatorial.
Actually the overpopulation myth was created to try and get third world countries to stop having children. The first world countries are terrifed that at some point, they will not be able to continue controlly everyone if they are eventually outnumbered. (read the Kissinger report for a start) Yes, there are enough resources to feed and house every human being on earth forever, if people actually cared enough to share their resources. it isn’t selfish to have children. It is selfish to murder them before they a born. You might want to acutally research something before you spout off. Your threading together soundbites is rather sad. Your ignorance is sad. You are all emotion, no fact.
Perhaps it is too late for you to do some research yourself(you just “spouted off”) before hand but here would be a good and amazingly simple way of starting for you. Simply search Peer reviewed literature for ,depletion of the oceans resources. ground water depletion. Destruction of forest. Air pollution. Oil and energy depletion.land depletion Climate change. Water pollution and depletion. Visit a site like Columbia Univ. Purdue Duke USGS Cornell Univ.Stanford Univ.NASA Nation science institute the United Nations,Academia.edu, Smithsonian. and literally HUNDREDS of other sites of higher education or SCIENCE. If you are so sad then go cry some and get over it. Your ignorance is astonishing. Do some actual research and change the channel from fox news and company or the christian network. You will discover how wrong you are if you live long enough. You guys think that Jesus will come back in your lifetime and you do not have to worry because the world will soon end as we know it anyway because your book says so. Not going to happen. Your ignorance is harming your and everyone’s great grandchildren. That ole boy is not just sad it is wrong and cannot allow that to happen.
Malthus beat you to the punch. of course, nothing Malthus projected turned out to occur.
Be patient. We will all pay within this century.THANKS from my grandchildren
It appears that you misunderstandd the definition of forever. Funny you calling someone out on facts. You wouldn’t know research or factual statements nor verifiable evidence if you stepped in it. What facts would you like to see? Proof of God? You probably arent going to find any, EVER. Peace.
If you knew the Armstrong family, and all the good they bring to this world themselves and through their young adult children, you’d be ashamed of your words. Casting those stones . . . enough!
I never said that she isn’t a wonderful person. I wonder if Mrs Armstrong has ever met miss Kardashian? You guys seem to enjoy and or agree with criticizing others that do not act or believe as you do but if someone criticizes anything about one of you then that person criticizing you is attacking ranting, they do not know the author etc etc… The author cast the stone as you say at Kim Kardashian and anyone who bought the book. READ THE ARTICLE!!!!! She was compelled for whatever reason to criticize KK her right to do so. Not what your Jesus taught you but never the less. I was compelled to criticize the author about ten children. if there are 50 million (there are really many times that amount) women of child bearing age and all of them have 10 children in one generation you would jump to 500,000 each of them has 10 children you would have 5 billion IN TWO GENERATIONS by the time you got to a stinking 20 generations you would be GONE!!!!! Do the math. All of this ignorant talk of how the world can sustain evryone now matter the numbers for ever is IGNORANT!
Souls last forever. Nothing else does. There is room in heaven for more souls. Btw, the earth is doing well. http://www.foxnews.com/…/happy-earth-day-2015-earth-is-do…/…
“There is room in heaven for more souls”?
That is just a religious belief and I find most religious beliefs to be either useless wishful thinking or unnecessary fears.
Anyone who can add well balanced productive people to the population are ok with me. But we can’t ignore overpopulation in some parts of the planet and thinking of their potential as souls in heaven is no excuse for having more kids than we can handle or the Earth can sustain.
I upvoted this reply because I do agree. However If we all brought 10 well balanced productive people to the population we would be so overpopulated that there would be no balance and production would basically stop.
What are you basing that statement on? And 2 of my 10 were orphans and are becoming doctors. Why would you think God messed up and made the Earth to small or that he would need to retract his statement to be “fruitful and multiply?”
It is irrelevant how much room there is in some mythological Camelot. What is relevant is how much room there is on EARTH. Your statement that the earth is doing well along with an naive or ignorant link to ” fox news” is sad. It is sad because it exposes the struggle we humans face.
The earth is NOT well. We are rapidly depleting its resources. We use fresh water with utter disregard. We pump tons of pollutants into earths atmosphere [ which the ten children will soon enough be coping with] We are now using 3barrels of water to extract one barrel of life killing oil. It is the peoples water that the huge capitalist corporations are using for their own profit. Corporations that spend $400,000.00 per day just to lobby congress.
Global Warming is real and everybody with half a brain and no monetary interest know this. Those that stand to lose their free money ride deny this even though they too know that it is true. The water is polluted. Go and drink a cup full of water from
the beautiful Niagara river. Looks can be deceiving. Dropping water tables, melting ice, northern polar ice reduced by 80%. Land becoming arid desert. Lake Meade will soon be so depleted that the turbines will stop. The Colorado river now dries up 90 miles from the ocean.An ocean which is itself a huge dump accumulating plastic and toxic waste as if it will cleanse itself “miraculously”. Millions dying from disease poverty and malnutrition. All caused by mans insatiable greed and his insane unsustainable capitalist economic system of constant non stop growth.
We all live on a FINITE planet with finite resources. Infinite growth from a finite planet is INSANE. Food raised with drugs and chemicals. Food grown with toxic poison sprayed all over without any regard for the earth or the people consuming that food. Simply the PROFIT. Education that is considered unessential or unimportant enough to run a school as they would run their corporation!!!!
I could go on for days. The Earth will be fine in time. The life [which btw we are a part of] is not FINE. It is in peril. To think otherwise is simply stupid. Blunt yes, but true. You either do not care, or are severely uneducated.
Whether you even have a soul is skeptical at best. Life is HERE AND NOW on EARTH. What happens in heavan is irrelevant. What is happening here on earth IS relevant and it is destroying the life on this magnificent rock which we call earth. The ONLY rock which we can live on.btw
Texastea2, Scientists are saying the Earth IS doing well. We should absolutely take care of it and not pollute, but there is NO overpopulation problem. However, there is a selfish problem that leaves no room in the heart for God.
For every so called scientist (think christian science/Fox) that claims that the earth is doing well and all of the life on earthis doing well there are a hundred scientist that will tell you they are either biased for monetary or religous reasons. If you were to go ask scientist at every major university on earth that studies the oceans, climate, biology genetics geology and all earth sciences you would find a different answer than all is well.
The overpopulation problemis real. If we lived without energy consumption as we do today it would not be as much of a problem YET! Right now most humans do not own a car house computer rv’s etc. Most do not ship their food in from thousands of miles as in USA this all is changing rapidly.Somewhere around 25% of humans drive a car everyday if that many. That is changing. Wait until that percentage hits 50 or 60%.
I am hopeful that when you read what your Pope just wrote on our over consumption of earths FINITE resources. Take it as a warning.
I unlike the Pope am free to state that what he claims WE MUST DO can actually ONLY be acheived by limiting and checking our human population. Again the consequences of OUR actions will be layed upon the feet of our great grand children and the generations of their off spring.
I hope that you and all of your wonderful family have been well and happy. Peace be with you.
I think you should move to Colorado and smoke some pot. Like right now.
You think that do you. Strange thought but I will assume it is not the first nor the last strange thought that resides in your mind. A little weird but hey at least you shared a thought. For that I say thanks. Peace
Read what the pope has to say on the environment and resources? Perhaps it will help you see what is coming in the near future. Less people by the way, equates to less resources consumed.
I wish you well.
Let me help you pack.
Go right ahead. That will not spare your great grand-children all the suffering your belligerence will cause them but they will know people tried to help them. Just sadly, not their own great grand mother.
EThere is no evidence to support the existence of “souls”. However there is plenty of evidence supporting the depletion of earths life sustaining resources. How one can think that the earth is well and fine is beyond my comprehending. It does not seem possible for someone to look at the facts and conclude that the earth is well. DO THE MATH!!!!!!!
the sahara desert alone could provide every human being on earth with a quarter of an acre to call their own. that is without building stories above or underground.
that would also leave the rest of the world for growing food.
Malthusian scare tactics only work with the ignorant.
Ask the pope to move the church to the sahara then. Good luck. OMD it is not a lack of terra firma to stand upon.WOW this is like the saying talking to the wall. I suppose you are going to miraculously convert sand to water and grow food by prayer alone? Ever wonder why we keep slashing and burning more and more forest. I do not believe it is because the land which they were on disappeared. It is the resources. Please just google it. It is really that simple. If you are up to a challenge I could drop you off on antarctica in the middle of the continent. You would have millions of acres to yourself. I think that you would soon learn that land is not what allows life to thrive. It takes food water. Fresh water. Both of which are being depleted at an alarming rate. I provided a method for you to see this for yourself.Any place of higher education with a life-science dept will do. Heck visit many of them just to triple check.
Lets just do that then move all humans to the sahara. BRILLIANT. You have it all figured out. Heck you seem to think that humans are the ONLY life on this planet. We are not. Is your brilliant plan feasable? Kill all the rest of life that is not raised for food? Pump and truck water for 10 billion people? I can’t believe we haven’t implamented this plan already.
the earth has never supported more people. the people on earth have never had more resources at their disposal.
Never supported more people. Of course it hasn’t. We agree. Actually 99.9999999% of humans will agree. The 2nd part I will simply state prove it. Search ocean resources water land air all are being exploited for profit at a rate of which 97% of all scientist agree is not sustainable. THAT IS A SIMPLE VERIFIABLE FACT.
I get the feeling that you have a lot of anger. I think you should invite Jesus into that. You must have some very deep wounds. Are you not able to have children or have you lost a child or aborted a child? Your rant usually indicates something seriously wrong in your life. Attacking others because they allow God, (who is the creator of all life,) determine how many children they have, is showing a glaring lack of understanding of our design.
Why do you sense I have alot of anger? I am angry about the way we are living. EVERYONE should be. LOL I am fine I laugh and enjoy life everyday.
Now lets see here. The author states that kim kardashian is a hedonistic selfish person for no other reason than taking selfies her entire life and putting them into some book. No anger no issue no anything! I state my opinion that having 10 children is selfish and I am deeply angry ranting etcetc… Really? FYI we humans are all selfish.
You did not claim the author was”attacking”(again really?) Kim K or claim she is angry hurt as a child or any of that language. When the critisim is directed at you it is different isn’t it.
The creator you believe in is just one of over a thousand known to have been believed inat one time. All of you think that you have found the truth and that everyone else is lost. I am not lost nor are hundreds of millions of others. There is no evidence for any of the supernatural things written in the jewish christian nor the muslim bibles. None. In fact the creation story written in the bible was written much earlier with the difference being a different god for each day. Many more stories found in the bible are built upon earlier stories. If one actually studies the history of religion one starts to understand how it evolved to where it is today.
I sense what I would describe as passive aggression in your comment.I also think that is perfectly natural. Hope to hear back from you. Enjoy your night.
Go back and read your words. Ranting, factless, attacking. That was your demeanor. I won’t debate with you about God. You don’t know Him and I understand that. You cannot comprehend what you have not been invited into. I shouldn’t say that, the Lord never stops for even one second, inviting you into His Life. You just can’t hear him. One cannot understand the bible without the help of the Holy Spirit. Actually, I have no problem with any criticism. That is one wonderful thing about having Jesus Christ in your life. You realize that there isn’t a single human on this earth that you have to please. Only HIM. Yes, you are lost. I used to be just like you. You have no idea that the world you see around you is the illusion. God is the reality. Just like the Lord opened the Apostle’s minds to Scripture, just as he transformed Saul in an instant. When He does enter your life, then you will see exactly who you and what you are. I pray you get to experience that. When you live in the darkness, you don’t even know it.
If you change your mind and want to debate about the existense of God let me know.You claim that I am lost. That is due in part to your ignorance. I am sure you will emotionally react and wrongly believe that I “attacked” you calling you ignorant. Actually it is no different than you calling me lost. Amazing how you guys dish out critcism yet attack those that call you on it.
being opposed to perfection might rightly be considered lost. God is perfection and you reject Him, right?
Being opposed to logic, verifiable scientific evidence and believing that a book is writtem by an “god” when the evidence shows plainly that it is simply a rehash of more ancient religions might rightly be considered ignorant or even bizarre behaviour. If I am lost because I used my brain and my eyes to educate myself on the matter then so be it. I did the same as millions of others I looked at the evidence for and against the creation story of the bible. The evidence for is literally non existent. The evidence against is enough to convict in any court in America. Claiming that one must have “the holy spirit” in order to understand the book is just more unprovable teachings. Lets just say that I feel just as strongly that you, friend, are the lost one.
Patti, your words are so true, and for some time now I have been asking myself why are things the way they are?
How could we have strayed so far from God’s truth. God gave us His Bible to enable us to live the best life possible, and yet it is estimated that less than ten percent of Christians have actually read His masterpiece from cover to cover. Media has bombarded us with negatives that bring us down. Beheading of Christians around the world just shows how we as a people have been desensitized to the point of blurring reality, as if it’s just another movie or TV show. People have accepted the premise that there is good and bad evil as depicted in the “Harry Potter” books. True Christians know that’s NOT possible under God. Fifty-million and counting babies aborted is treated as disposable nothing as people put themselves above anything that doesn’t serve their immediate interests. God’s Holy institution of marriage is now perverted away from God’s intent of one man and one woman under God
Christians are fragmented. Between all the cults out there professing to be at least partially Christian, and the new age proponents, and others who have tossed God aside for more worldly goals, it is no wonder that we have become our worst enemy. You don’t see that with Muslims and some other religions. They are one for all and all for one. Their agenda is from the pits of hell, united to eliminate anyone who doesn’t convert to their religion. The one and only God, which can only be found in the Bible is for all things good under Him. Who could possibly want for anything less? satan comes to mind and appears to be winning the souls of the unsuspecting, and we as True Christians just sit on the sidelines watching the parade go by.
What has happened is that people have put themselves above God to the point of thinking of themselves as god.
I don’t believe it’s ever too late to have change for the better, but looking at the handwriting on the wall, it appears that God’s wrath will come first.
His book His “masterpiece” have you no idea that the book was written by mere men? That it was edited and had many books rejected. That it took hundreds of years to put together. Or the fact that it simply retells with a spin much older creation stories?
You’re aware that you are on a Catholic site, right? You’re strutting back and forth with the rooster neck, “oh yeah, that’s right, uh huh.” I hate to harsh your buzz, but everything you just said is taught in most Catholic theology classes. Even the part — which you appear to think is the decisive smack down — that “the Bible retells with a spin much older creation stories.” My friend, in your desperation, you lurched involuntarily into a truth you do not fully understand. Now go register for a Catholic theology course to learn exactly how the Bible reinterpreted and transformed the ancient creation stories that were common knowledge at the time. The answer might surprise you!
Go, go! Take the class. We’ll wait for you. See you at the end of the semester!
Took awhile but the answer did not surprise me. That people buy into it astonishes me however.
Lets just get to the anti christ and armageddon already.
Perhaps then those that survive the insanity can start over without the desire to fulfill some mythological murderous end of days
nonsense.
One of the best things I’ve read in a recent months. Thanks, Patti.